The Therapeutic Touch they mention on the Rosa article is what I call Energy Healing, so thanks for sharing that. I’m not surprised that test failed, as its not representative of how I would experience a healing session. What I get are sensations of hot, cold or energy surges at specific points in the energy field but not throughout. So I might not always feel something over the hands. Anyhow, I don’t expect you to take my word for it. =)

I’d be happy to have my beliefs tested at some point in the future when I have a better idea of what they are and how to go about it. In the meantime I’ll have a dig through the Rosa references to see what else is out there. Appreciate you sharing the links as I really am curious about what’s true and what’s not.

Also, I found this quote on the latest SBM article to be interesting :

“Similarly, I really wonder if a rational/critical thinking module is missing or rudimentary for some people. How else can someone read about homeopathy or reiki and not laugh? Or maybe it is me. I lack the necessary neurologic module that can see the truth.” – Posted by Mark Crislip on Guiding Lights.

Hope your friend continues to do well.

I was trying to support your point.

Uh, what? I spend a lot of time looking at breast cancer research data, especially the surgical literature.

‘A friend recently went in for a lumpectomy, but that appointment was cancelled when her biopsy tests came in. The next week she had a double mastectomy’

I’m not sure what the above anecdote is meant to illustrate. There are a lot of factors that go into selecting a treatment regimen. Without knowing the details of your friends case I can’t comment on why a double mastectomy was performed.

My point was if my wife had a lump or an abnormal mammogram finding I would be more worried about missing a cancer than overdiagnosis.

If it was my wife I would take an unnecessary lumpectomy over a missed chance to cure every time.

Then there are those who look more closely at the data. A friend recently went in for a lumpectomy, but that appointment was cancelled when her biopsy tests came in. The next week she had a double mastectomy. Fortunately the subsequent reports from her hubby was that they got everything, and only minimal treatment will be needed.

The real kicker is that she is a PhD microbiologist who works for Big Pharma. More than a few times in the past few years has her employment been in jeopardy due to acquisitions, and failed drug trials. Despite assumptions, working for “Big Pharma” is no guarantee of riches (our friends only recently replaced a thirty year old car). I know of at least a couple other people whose companies were bought out, and they were let go because they refused to leave their families and move across the country.

I compliment you on your willingness to investigate the issue using resources like this blog.

Jose, the study states that 6-10 patients are overdiagnosed for every 2500 screened. Numerous studies show that breast cancer screening saves lives. I’ll take that trade-off.

In my practice I am aggressive about doing excisional biopsies/lumpectomies. They just aren’t very morbid. Of course there is the cost to the medical system, and the psycological stress to the patient. But missing the chance to cure a patient is something I hope never happens in my career.

If it was my wife I would take an unnecessary lumpectomy over a missed chance to cure every time.

http://jama.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx?articleid=187390

Geena, I’m delighted that you found your way to this site. I was especially intrigued by your comment that you can “feel the energy flowing.” Are you familiar with the Rosa study where therapeutic touch was tested and found wanting? What are your comments on that study? See http://www.quackwatch.com/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/tt.html
And here’s a link to the abstract of the paper: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9533499

Another intriguing statement was, “I’d love to see it tested in a robust way. The challenge might be who could fund something like that…” Have you heard of the James Randi Educational Foundation and their million dollar challenge? If you can feel human energy fields, you should be a cinch to win the prize. You have to agree to a fair test procedure with clear standards for failure or success, and you have to subject your claims to verifiable standards. I’m really glad you found your way to this website, too. I hope it means that you are willing to subject your beliefs to scientific scrutiny, and really find out what is true and what is not. I hope you will read about the history of claims like those you are making, such as the story of Franz Mesmer–perhaps the first to make claims about human energy fields. And I hope you will also find your way to another good site, The Skeptics Dictionary. I’m really interested in how your search turns out and I wish you well on your journey.

(I assume Dr Gosrski is still on hols). I assure you he would not say the same about mammographically detected cancers (he has written on that subject here), although, the “nearly” could possibly be stretched that far depending on what rate of overdiagnosis is considered most accurate.

The statement you are objecting to above refers to the outcome of a particular study and is a matter of fact for that group.

However, these results are supported by a lot of other general experience with breast cancer. They confirm what we would expect, that “nearly” all patients who refuse treatment, or who try to treat a symptomatic breast cancer with (most) “alternative” methods, will experience cancer progression. We know from other observations that an occasional one will stay much the same for long periods and a rare one will regress spontaneously.

On the evidence we now have this might not be quite the case with as many mammographically detected cancer.

- Refer to healing as complementary, not a replacement for medical intervention.
- We’re not allowed to advertise our services as a cure, or to mention specific diseases (i.e. no mention of cancer, diabetes, etc in the advertisements) and we can’t promise or allude to a positive outcome.

IOW you’re not permitted to commit outright fraud?

I also hate to break it to you, but energy healing HAS been repeatedly and robustly tested. And found to be nothing more than an elaborate placebo. You’re not doing anything for anybody other than providing some sympathetic human contact. Which is great, but it would be so much more appropriate to not try and dress it up with false claims about healing energies.

First off, no I don’t claim that what I do improves a client’s chance of survival (should have chosen my words more carefully). When I say “it works” I mean I can feel the energy flowing and so can my clients. I don’t have enough clinical experience with cancer patients or evidence to claim that healing will prolong their life or improve survival chances (but I’m open to the possibility) … I’ve had positive feedback from clients who came to see me with headaches, anxiety, stress, cramps, sore throats, PMS, energy levels, attitude, etc …

Self-assessments are subjective, and these symptoms aren’t linked to survival (as far as I’m aware) so I would not claim that energy healing prolongs a client’s life.

Back to your question about the UK being different from the US, accredited healers are regulated by a body called the British Alliance of Healing Associations, which is linked to another organization that accredits healers to work with the NHS (the national health system) and to work in hospitals. To become a member, qualify for insurance and be listed on the BAHA list of healers we have to agree to:

- Refer to healing as complementary, not a replacement for medical intervention.
- We’re not allowed to advertise our services as a cure, or to mention specific diseases (i.e. no mention of cancer, diabetes, etc in the advertisements) and we can’t promise or allude to a positive outcome.
- Its also best practice to refer to our clients (and not patients) as a patient is treated by a doctor.
- Healers that break the “Code of Conduct” are put on probation or banned

I don’t know the Code of Conduct by heart but this is probably different from what is common in the States?

It is possible to break the code and practice but the healer loses their accreditation, and depending on how aggressive their advertising is they might also break the law. My impression is that the regulations in the States are a lot more relaxed in general and it is easier to get away with misleading claims in that country. You can see this in something as obvious as anti-wrinkle creams, the same formula can be marketed in the States with claims that are generally thought to be “untrue” in Europe.

Thanks for pointing out that article on support groups, I will have a look =)

You will not find a very sympathetic hearing here, I am afraid, if you are claiming that what you do improves cancer survival, as opposed to offering the comforts of human interaction to some.

Read the recent post by Dr Coyne on the results of psychotherapy and support groups for cancer patients. There has already been considerable study of mind-body interventions with very unconvincing results.

What’s more, few experienced oncologists would expect either energy or mind-body influences to be helpful with this disease. Most kinds of cancer are just too predictable, regardless of the frame of mind, spiritual allegiances and determination of the patient. Also, where cancer is variable in behaviour, that has in many cases already been linked to differences in the the biological make-up of the cancer, permitting some individualization of treatments..

We would need very dramatic preliminary evidence before diverting resources to looking elsewhere.

Not really. While the authors don’t say so, the large number of stage ll and stage lll lesions in that study suggests that these are symptomatic cancers, not mammographically detected ones.

The overdiagnosis problem relates to the tiny, often 2 -3 mm lesions that can be picked up by quality mammography. It is assumed that some of these may never progress or get to produce symptoms within the patient’s lifetime. (What is needed is a way of treating these less aggressively when it is safe to do so.)

Symptomatic cancer, which is rarely less than 1 cm in size and very often 2cm or more, is a very different subset of cancer. If a woman (or her doctor or partner) finds a <b<new lump, or if it is tender, inflamed or distorting the breast, that strongly suggests already progressive cancer.

The high percentage of more advanced cancers in those who opted against conventional care suggests that these patients may have been aware of a breast abnormality for some time and quite likely already been trying out “alternative” care.

I think giving accurate reviews on there will help influence people away from these quack therapies.

- Energy Healing is meant to be added to medical intervention, it isn’t a substitute. I always tell my clients and my readers that to forgo medical treatment for alternative, natural or complementary medicine would be irresponsible and it would give them less of a chance of survival. Energy Healing works on the emotional, mental and spiritual layers and I “believe” this has an effect on the physical, but that effect will not be swift enough to replace medical intervention. Why put yourself at risk when there has been so much research behind existing medical treatments.

- With respect to any potential RCT’s on Energy Healing … I think the only way to prove or disprove it would be to have two separate groups, both would undergo the medical treatment prescribed by their doctors. One group would have qualified energy healers working with the patients to release blocks and shift energy, the other “control” group would have people going through the motions without channeling healing of any sort (or giving placebo pills, if its an alternative medicine/supplement they are testing.

I believe in energy healing because of what I see and feel when I’m working with individual clients, and I’d love to see it tested in a robust way. The challenge might be who could fund something like that … In any case I only position myself as a complementary therapist and I choose not work with clients who reject medical care.

I’m curious about your thoughts on the mind-body link in general and if you notice any patterns in your patients?

Thanks,

Geena

ps …. I am really glad to have found your blog! At the moment I’m transitioning from a day job in science based health care to energy healing and I am very interested in where the two can meet. Hope to hear from you.

Given these apprehensions, I found the following statement “nearly every patient who initially refused treatment progressed to a higher stage” disturbing. If this is true then there should be no overdiagnosis in breast cancer patients