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The Weekly Waluation of the Weasel Words of Woo #8

Playing with More than a Full Deck!

The passage submitted in the W^5/2 #7 wasn’t an easy one, but intrepid translators, for the most part, offered waluable insights:

Readers were virtually unanimous in the opinion that author Jean Watson, when she uttered it, must have been in an, er, alternative state of consciousness. I can’t imagine what gave them that idea. I mean look at her. No, the answer lies elsewhere, but was unknown even to your faithful judge until after he had posted that fateful entry: Ms. Watson can be nothing other than a High Priestess in the Mysterious Order that shall henceforth be known as the Hazy and Harrying Hermeneutics of Hermano©!

Michelle B added crucial points about Ms. Watson’s literary prowess, a vital, eternal theme here at the W^5/2.

Recognizing that he was in over his head, Overshoot cleverly borrowed a periscope from a previous W^5/2 and brought the whole thing into focus (damn, who woulda figured that those Gods and Goddesses could clean up so nice, way out there in the void?).

DVMKurmes correctly invoked “copies of Stonehenge” to interpret Ms. Watson’s mystical words. Such mysticism always involves copies of Stonehenge. Doesn’t it?

Michael X seemed surprised that dissipating a temporal flux in the gravometric vortex would fix the pinging sound in his car. Well, duh. Where did he do his industrial arts?

Spiv solved the calendar riddle, which I gotta admit had me stumped. Oh wow: is that blue, like, the blue stuff you c’n put in yer terlet tank? And what’n the hell is that dang deal way down in there? Wait just a goddamn minute….is that Overshoot peering out of a Yellow Submarine?

Stu (m’man!) seems to think that just because he’s, like, a god around here means he can just like write random words and get away with it. Well I got news for him: here at the W^5/2 we’re on a strictly “what have you done for me lately” basis and that just ain’t gonna…er, wait a minute, uh…hmmm…OK (my bad): that’s exactly what Jean Watson did in the first place! (Plus, Stu flashed pretty much my entire life before me, so it couldn’a been entirely random.)

Yeah, but did anyone actually “get” it? Well, yes, I think (since I’m not entirely certain what “it” is): Overshoot and DVMKurmes’ translations were on the money for my money, calling attention as they did to Ms. Watson’s apparent distaste for pesky old destructive and violent rational thinking insofar as some people might have the temerity to pretend that it has anything to do with, like, figuring out diseases.

And the Winner is…

Those translations took a back seat, however, to that of a newcomer to the venerated W^5/2:

Beowulff, who combined timely parody with the erudition of that endangered species once known as a “liberal education” (Michelle B: is that gun loaded?) to produce the hands-down funniest, rightest-on, clearest-cut Winning Waluation of the Week©!

This Week’s Entry: from the Bountiful Benighted Babblings of Befuddled Boobs®

This week’s entry, in keeping with the current theme of my regular blog, is quoted from an article titled “Preventing Breast Cancer.” It was written by a former faculty member at Bastyr University who is a co-author of the American Association of Naturopathic Physicians (AANP) Position Paper on Homeopathy:

So, what can I do to lower my risk of getting breast cancer?

2. Keep your breasts happy and healthy. Love them and yourself. We often develop illnesses because of our own unresolved feelings and lack of love for ourselves. Our breasts are beautiful, no matter what their size or shape. Breasts and wombs are the primordial symbols of womanhood, not just motherhood. Appreciate your breasts as a bountiful source of your love and creative energy. Deal with any unresolved maternal, nurturing, and relationship issues so they’re not lurking in your breasts….Visualize your breasts overflowing with love, nurturing, and creativity. And let that love and nurturance heal you and all beings.

Happy Waluating!

Note to TsuDhoNimh (or anyone else wishing to submit a Potential Passage of Woo for the W^5/2): go for it. My email address is public; you can find it with a little digging. I say that not to be coy, merely to discourage indiscriminate use. I already get a zillion/day, so I trust y’all not to abuse it.

The Misleading Language and Weekly Waluation of the Weasel Words of Woo series:

  1. Lies, Damned Lies, and ‘Integrative Medicine’
  2. Integrative Medicine: “Patient-Centered Care” is the new Medical Paternalism

Posted in: General, Humor, Science and the Media

Leave a Comment (104) ↓

104 thoughts on “The Weekly Waluation of the Weasel Words of Woo #8

  1. Michelle B says:

    (Michelle B: is that gun loaded?)
    ____

    I never enter a kitchen without my spice gun:

    http://gizmodo.com/353088/spice-gun-gives-cooking-added-bang

  2. Michelle B says:

    This is not an translation, but by substituting a male feature, the absurdity of pandering to such an idiotic conception of what constitutes the essence a woman becomes apparent (if our culture respected women would the poor quality underwear/shoes that we until quite recently had to endure, would not have been so prevalent for so long–double standards for the two sexes forever abound):

    So, what can I do to lower my risk of getting prostate cancer?

    2. Keep your prostate happy and healthy. Love it and yourself. We often develop illnesses because of our own unresolved feelings and lack of love for ourselves. Our prostate glands are beautiful, no matter what their size or shape. Prostate glands are the primordial symbols of manhood, not just fatherhood. Appreciate your prostate gland as a bountiful source of your love and creative energy. Deal with any unresolved paternal, husbanding, and relationship issues so they’re not lurking in your prostate glands.

    Visualize your prostate overflowing with love, husbandry, and creativity. And let that love and paternal care heal you and all beings.

  3. Michelle B says:

    Even, in the land of woo, this would not go down well.

  4. Michelle B, I took the liberty of editing the end of your post to retain its Power of Simple Substitution.

  5. Michelle B says:

    Thanks, Kimball. But I wrote it slightly different: Visualize our prostate overflowing with love, husbandry, and creativity. And let that love and paternal care heal you and all beings. (so the male substitution carries to the end)

  6. Jessa B says:

    Channeling Stuart Smalley:

    “My breasts are good enough, smart enough, and doggone it, people like them.”

  7. weing says:

    I guess kids with stretch marks around their mouths will be living proof of your immunity to breast cancer.

  8. Michelle: so you did! I made the appropriate changes.

    If I read weing correctly, by the way, the male-substitution version of such cancer immunity must have something to do with having one’s head up his, Ur, anus.

  9. Joe says:

    Professor Harold Hill comes to mind “If you think the minuet in G, you’ll play the minuet in G.”

    Michelle B’s poor understanding of prostates, should disqualify her. After all, she wrote “Our prostate glands are beautiful, no matter what their size or shape.” As men age, we live in fear of an enlarged prostate; in this case- size does matter, and bigger ain’t better.

    There is also the Roman Catholic notion of benefiting from saying ‘ejaculations.’ However, recent research on prostate cancer-prevention suggests that saying them may not be enough.

    (This is my first experiment using italics. If it comes out with angle bracketed codes … what else can I write?)

  10. Michelle B says:

    Using my beloved culinary language, if this writer was a crème brulee, I wouldn’t skimp on the torching.

    Though this writer does not top the revolting claims of the pushers (Kushi) of macrobiotic diet that their diet would render one invincible in the face of a nuclear event, it does add a disgusting sexist twist.

    What is she really saying? That women who are alive because of mastectomies are not women and they do not love themselves? And to think that this female writer regards herself as a loving, positive thinking person. Religious/woo believers, who preach fire and brimstone and ineffective methods of healing and present themselves as loving, good, people who know what is best for you because of their hotline to god or to universal intuition truly disgust me.

    If we hire a carnival barker and set up a tent show for alternative medicine freaks, I am recommending this writer get top billing.

    Joe, I can’t be disqualified, because I did not offer a translation and therefore am not a contestant in this week’s contest (teehee). Congrats on your expanding your web skills. Italicized words are so pretty.

  11. Joe says:

    Michelle B wrote “Joe, I can’t be disqualified, because I did not offer a translation and therefore am not a contestant in this week’s contest (teehee).”

    Hah! You forget “Animal House.” You could be on double-secret disqualification and never know it.

    On the serious side, you also wrote “What is she really saying? That women who are alive because of mastectomies are not women and they do not love themselves?” Yes, that is revolting.

  12. Joe says:

    It looks like I still need to master the “bolding thing.”

  13. mmarsh says:

    Translation: Tinkerbell is an OT VII.

  14. Hermano says:

    Is it too late to join the hyena laugh fest ridiculing Judyth Reichenberg-Ullman N.D article ‘Preventing Breast Cancer’?
    You can increase your fun an order of magnitude since there are
    10 points she is making, all equally worthy of derision.
    I’m not very practiced at this, forgive me if my joke is not to your high standards “This 1996 article is out of date and does not represent the state of the art thinking in naturopathic medicine since it does not mention hydrogen peroxide”.
    Have at it,

    ” You might be asking yourself, “So, why is she telling me all of these gory details? Is she trying to scare me?” The answer is an emphatic “no”! My hope in writing this article is to stimulate you to pay more attention to your breasts and to lead a lifestyle which is likely to result in your never getting breast cancer.

    So, what can I do to lower my risk of getting breast cancer?

    1. Don’t obsess about breast cancer! If you follow these guidelines, you are doing all that you can to minimize your risk. Use the statistics as reminders to take care of your body, but don’t get hung up on them. Your destiny is largely up to you. The more you feed a fear, the more likely it is to manifest.
    2. Keep your breasts happy and healthy. Love them and yourself. We often develop illnesses because of our own unresolved feelings and lack of love for ourselves. Our breasts are beautiful, no matter what their size or shape. Breasts and wombs are the primordial symbols of womanhood, not just motherhood. Appreciate your breasts as a bountiful source of your love and creative energy. Deal with any unresolved maternal, nurturing, and relationship issues so they’re not lurking in your breasts.
    3. Check your own breasts regularly. Do monthly self-breast examinations after your period is over. If you find any lumps or tenderness that concerns you, have it checked out right away, before your fear or denial mechanisms get going. If you have fears about examining or touching your breasts, get some help to overcome those fears. More than one of the articles I read about breast cancer warned against relying on self- breast exams to discover breast cancer. I agree that women shouldn’t rely totally on self-exams, however self-breast exams allow you to get to know your body better, help you to feel more in control of your body, and will sometimes result in your finding a breast lump which has not been diagnosed. Fortunately, 80% of breast lumps are benign. When you examine your breasts, remember that lumps which are soft, movable, and change with your menstrual cycle are much less likely to be cancerous. Any discharge from the nipple other than breast milk should be checked out by your health professional.
    4. Have your breasts examined by a professional. Go get a breast exam from an experienced women’s health care practitioner once a year, at the same time you get your Pap smear. She (or he) will have felt a lot of breasts and will be able to offer you reassurance as well as catching any problems.
    5. Get regular mammograms. Most of us, myself included, are suspicious of radiation of any kind. With good reason. There are definitely some sources of radiation that actually increase the risk of cancers. From all that I have read, however, it seems that mammograms are free of danger and greatly increase the odds of discovering breast cancer earler than you would by just examining your breast. I had my first mammogram last year, after seeing two patients in my office with metastatic breast cancer. It only hurt a little, when they pressed my breasts down on the radiographic plate, and I, like most women, was relieved to have a normal mammogram. I f I feel any suspicious abnormalities in my patients’ breasts, I do recom- mend a mammogram. I n a woman without breast symptoms and with no significant risk of breast cancer, I recommend mammogams beginning age 35 or 40 every two years (or yearly, if she prefers). For women without breast symptoms who are at higher risk of breast cancer, I recommend yearly mammograms beginning at age 35. Beginning at age 50, the rate of breast cancer goes up, so yearly mammograms are a good idea. My motto about mammograms, trite though it may sound, is “Better safe than sorry.”
    6. Reduce your dietary fat. Whether or not it is confirmed by all the scientific studies, there is clearly enough information to suggest that the more fat you eat, the higher your risk of breast cancer. And since a high fat diet also predisposes to heart disease, obesity, gall bladder disease, osteopoosis, and a myriad of other problems, you can’t lose by cutting down on rich foods. The absolute best way to decrease fat intake is to become a vegan (no meat, chicken, fish, or dairy). Next best is to be an ovo-lacto vegetarian. Next to only include fish, etc. The worst sources of fat are red meat and deep-fried foods, but fats are often hidden. If you do eat dairy, choose low-fat milk, cheese, and yogurt. It’s best to begin to reduce fat as early as possible after puberty, before poor eating habits and excessive weight set in.
    7. Think twice (or more) about taking hormones of any kind. There are natural alternatives for birth control, menstrual problems, and menopause. Consider them carefully before taking hormones.
    8. If you can, have your babies earlier rather than later. Not every woman has her babies according to schedule, but having your first child before age 30 will reduce your risk of breast cancer.
    9. Limit alcohol intake. Don’t drink more than one glass of alcohol a couple times a week.
    10. Cut out caffeine. Caffeine, in addition to jangling your nervous system, causes breast cysts in many women. Even though there’s no direct correlation with breast cancer, why take a chance?”

  15. Fifi says:

    Hermano – 3 – “Deal with any unresolved maternal, nurturing, and relationship issues so they’re not lurking in your breasts.”

    Heh, how uncomfortable and out of touch with your body and your emotions do you have to be to believe that you have “unresolved issues lurking in your breasts”? Oh, right, women are personally responsible for giving themselves breast cancer by not being maternal or nurturing enough. What a misogynist belief to be promoting.

  16. Michelle B says:

    Hermano, the other 9 reasonable points are presented by many doctors, why go to a nut who defines a human being by her sex?

  17. Hermano says:

    I loved the snide comment about Jean Watson’s appearance
    “…alternative state of consciousness. I can’t imagine what gave them that idea. I mean look at her.”
    Obviously, K. Atwood cares deeply about what a person looks like.
    I did not find any photos of him online, but I wonder.
    Are Kimball Atwood and Art “King” Atwood the same person?
    Both are great poseurs, and the comment above is just what one might expect from Art.
    Just one question for the “King”, what are you on?
    http://youtube.com/watch?v=g3GqQV8Plt8

  18. Hermano says:

    Fifi,

    I know! It’s so funny.
    Look at this one:
    “5. Get regular mammograms.”
    What a moron!

  19. Hermano says:

    Michelle,
    I thought “biology is destiny” is the currency here.
    You don’t really believe women have “soul” or “spirit”, do you?

  20. Fifi says:

    Hermano – Just because someone mixes some science in with their woo doesn’t make the woo into science.

    As a woman, I also take issue with number 7. It seems benign on the surface to say that there are “natural alternatives” but considering that some of the herbs that are promoted as “safe, natural alternatives” can be quite toxic it’s not benign to promote them as safe at all. Clearly the Pill and access to legal and safe birth control and abortion had an impact on women’s ability to control their fertility and pregnancy in a way that “alternatives” never could.

    Combined with the notion that women get breast cancer because of “negative/bad” thoughts or issues with being maternal, it’s clear that there’s quite a bit of misogyny at work. The mother/goddess objectification of women is no less misogynist than the madonna/whore dichotomy in that it posits women as “good” if they’re a mommy and “bad” if they’ve got interests other than dedicating their life to babies (be they grown men or children sucking at her teets). And, of course, “bad” women are punished by illness which they brought upon themselves. It’s lame and the same old crap dressed up in woo.

  21. Fifi says:

    Apparently you’ve been projecting beliefs onto all kinds onto others if you think that contemporary science proposes “biology is destiny”. Destiny is something that fortune tellers, astrologers, the religious and those dualists who believe that there’s a soul/spirit that exists independently of the body believe in.

  22. Fifi says:

    10 – There’s some pretty interesting research on the positive health effects of coffee. Amongst other things, a recent study has shown that coffee may in fact be protective against certain kinds of breast cancer. (It’s an article not the study so I won’t vouch for the design of the study.) The researchers aren’t using the study to advocate for coffee drinking (or to sell coffee supplements or enemas) and say that more research still needs to be done.

    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/04/080424115324.htm

    Now, if that particular nurse was practicing EBM she’d be updating her info not just selling an ideology by trying to hide it by pretending to promote EB procedures while really promoting the idea that women bring cancer upon themselves via their “negative” thoughts (such a Judeo-Christian good girl/bad girl idea!).

  23. overshoot says:

    Joe:

    Michelle B’s poor understanding of prostates, should disqualify her. After all, she wrote “Our prostate glands are beautiful, no matter what their size or shape.” As men age, we live in fear of an enlarged prostate; in this case- size does matter, and bigger ain’t better.

    You know you’ve reached middle age when “small and soft” sounds good.

    Or, as we observed at my high school 30th reunion:

    Benign prostatic hypertrophy is karmic balance for men never being pregnant.

  24. Hermano says:

    Fifi,
    I really do not think Judyth Reichenberg-Ullman is judging anyone, man or woman, as good or bad.
    You are the one labeling her as a misogynist.
    She simply recommends
    In (2) that people accept themselves and love themselves.
    I understand everyone here find that ridiculous, I think it is good advice.
    In (7) that they think twice about the consequences of taking hormones.
    Thinking about something is not denying its use.
    Not everyone is as intolerant, judgmental, and ready to see the worse in people as you imagine.
    Except the French.

  25. Fifi says:

    9 – A glass or two (no more) of red wine a day is considered possibly protective, other forms of alcohol aren’t, so the advice on alcohol isn’t really accurate either.

  26. Hermano,

    I had no idea that I had been “outed” on YouTube! Seriously, thanks for the big guffaw, even if it came from a misunderstanding: what I meant by “look at her” was that in the linked photographs, she doesn’t appear to be drunk or otherwise under the influence of mind-altering substances. On the contrary, she looks kinda nerdy, which is probably what my own photo will suggest if I ever get around to posting it. She does look a little goofy—but so do a lot of people in snapshots, which is the extent, if there was any, of my “snideness.” What makes her photographs fair game for that mildly unfair suggestion is the combination of her abundant self-promotion (see her website) and her abundantly goofy words, which, after all, were the topic of the post.

  27. Fifi says:

    Hermano – I am pointing out the ideas she promotes as misogynist. I would suspect she’s internalized her beliefs and she’s unaware of the misogyny of her own beliefs and may even consider them “empowering”. Of course, she’s actually disempowering women by promoting the idea that women bring breast cancer upon themselves by their non-maternal thoughts (and promoting an ultimately very Christian idea about good/bad and reward/punishment even though it’s wrapped up in woo-speak which pretends to be non-judgmental). Also, because it’s spreading untruths this ideology disempowers women doubly by creating disinformation making it more difficult for a woman to make an informed choice based upon sound evidence. Of course, getting rid of evidence is what woo’s all about.

  28. Fifi says:

    Hermano – If she was actually promoting self acceptance she wouldn’t be promoting the idea that women bring breast cancer upon themselves by their thoughts about their breasts and maternity, that they’re somehow being punished for not conforming to some maternal ideal. She’s actually promoting the idea that women who get breast cancer get it because they’re not good enough or maternal enough somehow – that doesn’t sound like promoting self acceptance to me, it sounds like promoting an ideal and trying to provoke guilt and shame in a woman who’s vulnerable due to illness. She may mean well but she’s potentially doing a lot of harm.

    It’s not a case of seeing the worst, just a matter of seeing something for what it is not what it promotes itself as. It only takes basic critical thinking skills and discernment to see the misogyny in the beliefs she’s promoting.

  29. Michelle B says:

    Fifi excellent responses! Some of the worst sexists I have met are female, and some of the best feminists are male.

    Hermano wrote: You don’t really believe women have “soul” or “spirit”, do you?

    I am guessing here that the writer of this week’s woo waluation believes her soul is in her breasts.

    I do regard myself as being a very spirited, even a spiritual (in the a non supernatural sense) person. I get quite high on the emergent properties of being a physical being. I believe in courage, gumption, critical thinking, learning from my mistakes, enjoying life, and embracing reality while vigilantly keeping in check the human brain’s propensity to mix stuff up. We all have the equivalent of a potent simulation software in our brains–I enjoy it but I don’t let my mind be so open my brains fall out. Life is such a rich tapestry of experience, and I am so lucky to be alive.

  30. Michelle B says:

    Positive thinking can be a boon psychologically, and there are some effective therapies that emphasize this, brief therapy is the one with which I am most familiar. No need to go to woo for this effect.

    Hermano fishing to see if I am spiritual enough to provide a sense of love and respect for myself is underhanded and a budding strawbaby I suspect. Like macho men wanting to teach a woman how to enjoy being a real woman, we got the wooer’s wanting to teach us how to be a full person, that we are lacking the profoundity of their approach as we are stuck on just the physical level. They have nothing to offer us that is not all ready being explored by philosophy, cognitive psychology, literature, etc.

  31. Hermano says:

    Michelle,
    People in general, myself included, lack profundity and scratch at the superficial.
    This is certainly the impression I get from majority of the posts and comments here and, no, I do not think you are any different.

    I find loving and accepting oneself very difficult.
    Try this,
    (1) think of someone you love.
    (2) address yourself and say ‘I love you’.

    People usually say that they (1) do not first think of themselves as someone they love, and (2) find it easier to address someone other than themselves in saying ‘I love you’.

  32. TsuDhoNimh says:

    Good grief … where to begin with the womanly, weasely woo-ishness of this. I am channeling The Woo-nderful Woozard who hat tapped into the thoughts of the author of this steaming pile of woo, so that I may reveal them, using my awesome powers of italic text :

    We often develop illnesses because of our own unresolved feelings and lack of love for ourselves. Hinting that the patient is responsible for bringing on their cancer is one way to prepare them for being blamed for their failure to heal because they don’t believe enough in my woo-nderful therapy. Our breasts are beautiful, no matter what their size or shape. Unless, of course, you want to try my all-natural all-herbal breast enhancement cream. Breasts and wombs are the primordial symbols of womanhood, not just motherhood. That should get the childless career women to shut up. Appreciate your breasts as a bountiful source of your love and creative energy. That should convince her to pay for at least three workshops in to unleash your creativity womanliness by prancing braless in the rain while chanting and thumping on pyramidal shaped drums. Deal with any unresolved maternal, nurturing, and relationship issues so they’re not lurking in your breasts. And, we offer workshops to oncologists on how to distinguish lurking issues from clogged milk ducts and ductal carcinoma in situ. May qualify for CE credits in some states.

    Visualize your breasts overflowing with love, nurturing, and creativity.Like breast milk, but not as messy. And let that love and nurturance heal you and all beings. Now I’ve really dumped a load of guilt. Like a Buddhist monk, she is now responsible not just for herself, but all beings everywhere.

    *********
    Michelle and Fifi … nice work.

  33. Hermano says:

    Fifi,
    I really think you are reading too much into Judyth’s “Love your breasts and yourself” to find misogyny where there is none.
    People, women included, often have poor body image.
    You are right to think that science based medicine could do better than woolly visualizations and affirmations to resolve these feelings of inadequacy.
    Here is concrete evidence
    “Breast Enlargement Surgery Linked To Boost In Self-Esteem And Sexuality” http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/65837.php .
    Some numbers from 2005,
    “Breast Augmentation with 364,610 procedures up nine percent from 2004. For the first time, we categorized saline vs. silicone augmentation. 83.4 percent of respondents used the saline device, 16.6 percent the silicone implant.”
    http://www.surgery.org/press/procedurefacts-asqf.php .
    Breast Augmentation costs $5,000-$10,000 http://www.smartbreastaugmentation.com/costs.html .
    Average $7,500 for 400,000 procedures totals $3Bn.
    I estimate that $3Bn is 15-20 times what all 2,500 NDs earned last year.
    If you want real quality you must pay for it.

  34. Hermano says:

    K. Atwood,

    I was hoping you would enjoy the Art Atwood video.

  35. vinny says:

    Hermano,
    Apparently you fail to appreciate the difference between nonsense and reasonable advice. Ullman reiterated some common preventive medicine statements, and added a bit of lunacy. I cannot understand why you are working so hard to uphold the irrational statements made by Ullman ND. Consider such approach to Adolf Hitler: on the one hand he stated that Germany is a great nation and Germans must be proud of their history and achievements. No with such a statement, but next he said that all the problems vexing Germans are caused by Jews, and this is dangerous nonsense. Would you defend Hitler as vigorously because sometimes he gave the correct time?

  36. vinny says:

    that was meant to be “achievements. No problems with such a statement”

  37. Hermano says:

    Vinny,
    I guess it is never to late to learn something new and change one’s opinion.
    I read in the scienceblogs that the Nazis did like their homeopathy
    http://scienceblogs.com/neurophilosophy/2008/06/the_homeopathic_challenge.php,
    and, apparently, Adolf liked dogs.
    They probably got a worse rep than they deserved.
    I suspect the joint work of the AMA and the Hadassah.

  38. Harriet Hall says:

    Hermano said,

    “I suspect the joint work of the AMA and the Hadassah.”

    Are you a conspiracy theorist? Do you have any basis for such a suspicion?

  39. Fifi says:

    Hermano, there’s nothing wrong with promoting an accepting and self loving body image. It’s the associating “negative” thoughts as the cause of cancer that’s problematic (and hardly a constructive thing to do). It’s also important to note that if someone has real issues they need a psychologist not woolly affirmations and supplements (and the linking up “negative” thoughts with disease would be doubly problematic for patients with issues regarding their body or sexuality).
    There’s obviously nothing wrong with positive self talk and cognitive therapy can be very helpful (while avoiding denial, which is the pitfall of affirmations). It’s good to be comfortable in one’s skin no matter who one is and it makes life a hell of a lot more enjoyable. On the other hand, people are also free to decide to avail themselves of elective plastic surgery if they’d like to improve on nature and think it’s worth the risk (and have the disposable income). Certainly in a society that values aesthetics plastic surgery serves many purposes, it’s used to allow people who’ve been disfigured to lead more normal lives as well as an upgrade to become more of whatever the ideal beauty is in that time and place. Plastic surgery has also been instrumental in allowing transgendered people to choose to live in the body they feel is appropriate. Really, it’s an individual’s choice what they do with their body as long as they’re informed of the risks and aren’t suffering from a psychological disorder that makes them incapable of making a rational decision.
    The misogyny is hidden within the idea that women get sick as a punishment/result of thinking “negative” (unwomanly, unmotherly) thoughts and their breasts get filled with these “diseased” thoughts.

  40. Hermano says:

    H. Hall,

    There is absolutely no reason to suspect that Hadassah ever conspired to do anything.
    It’s a charitable organization known for running thrift stores, similar to Salvation Army or Goodwill
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hadassah .
    I was going for sarcasm, hoping to show how ridiculous it is to
    compare Judyth R.-U. to Hitler.

  41. Hermano says:

    Fifi,
    Your position reminds me of the famous “Millions for defense, but not one cent for tribute.” by Robert Goodloe Harper.
    To paraphrase, “Billions for breast augmentation, but not one cent
    for naturopathy”.

  42. Michelle B says:

    Hermano,

    I thought of the love I have for my husband, which then brought into consciousness his immense love for me, and then it was very easy to say I love myself.

    Learning is an ongoing process. Using my beloved culinary imagery once again, nothing satisfies the taste buds like something simple, like a freshly baked loaf of crusty French bread a la campagne (sourdough made just with water, flour, and salt) spread with a bit of cold butter. And yet, the ability to be wowed by that simple dish and not seduced by a fancier one, takes time to develop.

    In my youth, many friends of mine were embracing Eastern mysticism. They worked so hard to be profound. Looking back at their often stymied efforts, if I knew what I know now, I would have said, hey, live, just live, the depth deepens without you even trying to deepen it.

    The New Age approach to me is a hard sell for a problem that does not really exist!

  43. AntiVax says:

    Talking of loving your breasts

    ‘In general, the conflicts linked to a breast gland carcinoma always relate to an argument conflict or worry conflict, while for milk duct ulcerations it is always a separation conflict.’
    http://whale.to/cancer/hamer.html

    Talking of woo, the best allopathic ‘therapy’ for breast cancer i still surgery! So when is surgery going to cure braest cancer?

  44. Fifi says:

    Hermano – Really? What an odd thing to be reminded of since your or my tax dollars don’t go to pay for elective cosmetic surgery!!! Personally if I was American I’d be much more outraged about my tax dollars going to fund research and treatments of woo, and that the US government allows supplement companies to create tax free non-profits to promote their supplements and pseudoscience. Now THAT’S a SCAM.

    What people do with their personal money and their body is their own business as far as I’m concerned – I don’t even have an issue with people choosing alternative therapies or no treatment if they’re making informed choices not being scammed. It’s their billions (or thousands) and for all you know these same people may also fund breast cancer research. Billions get wasted on vitamins and supplements too, which would actually do all kinds of good if given to people who were actually suffering from malnutrition. Millions for vanity supplements (with their promises of eternal youth) but not a cent for the starving of the world. Millions of taxpayer and charity dollars diverted from cancer research to propaganda fronts for the supplement industry, now that’s outrageous! We can all play the diversionary games you play that revolve around the greed and vanity of Americans – and it’s this greed, vanity, fear and hope that are actually exactly what the supplement industry exploits.

  45. Michelle B says:

    Wow, Fifi, you bested your best reply.

  46. vinny says:

    Hermano, I understood your sarcasm but you failed to understand my point. Let me repeat it for the reality challenged group. An occasional reasonable statement, doesn’t automatically make every word that comes out of that mouth reasonable. Could you please focus your defence solely on the point #2 of Ullman’s advice. Do you realize that it is only that point, that has been the subject of this post? Not everything is equally valid; try to break through this wall of nihilistic denial you have built and let reality in.

  47. Fifi says:

    Hermano – It’s also a crock of bull to make medicine analogous to the military and naturopathy analogous to tribute. And an odd analogy too when one of the most vocal supporters of the supplement industry (the notorious General Stubblebine of “Health Freedom USA”) is not only ex-US military but was (is?) involved with the seamier side of mind control and developing torture techniques (some used in Abu Ghraib). So far I can see tax dollars trickling down the woo funnel into supplement manufacturers’ pockets but none coming back out for anything other than promotion and lobbying.

  48. David Gorski says:

    Talking of woo, the best allopathic ‘therapy’ for breast cancer i still surgery! So when is surgery going to cure braest cancer?

    Actually, surgery does cure many breast cancers, as long as they have not metastasized beyond the axillary lymph nodes.

    See:

    http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/?p=10
    http://www.users.on.net/~pmoran/cancer/BCtestimonial.htm

    I note that you’re quoting Ryke Geerd Hamer and the German New Medicine. Did you know that Hamer has been responsible for leading some patients to their deaths through refusing treatment? See this “testimonial”:

    http://www.ariplex.com/ama/amamiche.htm
    http://www.ariplex.com/ama/ama_p0.htm

    German New Medicine is dangerous quackery based on no science. (Indeed, I’ve been meaning to do a post on it since SBM started, and you may have provided just the impetus for me to do so.) Worse, it’s a horrific “blame the patient” sort of philosophy where if a patient dies or doesn’t improve it’s because of an “unresolved conflict” that the patient is unable to resolve.

  49. Fifi says:

    Hermano – Equally I have to wonder why you’re passing judgment on women who choose to have plastic surgery. Adult women have the right to choose what they do with their body and their money.

  50. Michelle B says:

    Fifi wrote: Adult women have the right to choose what they do with their body and their money.
    _____

    Women are adults?

  51. Fifi says:

    MichelleB – Ah well, sometimes one has to restate the obvious!

  52. Michelle B says:

    I wrote earlier in this thread: Hermano fishing to see if I am spiritual enough to provide a sense of love and respect for myself is underhanded and a budding strawbaby I suspect.
    ____

    True to crooked woo form, the said strawbaby is now a galloping giant strawman with its straw stuffing hanging out all over the place thanks to rational commenters at this thread. What does love and respect (real and valid emergent properties of humanity) have to do with this whacked-out writer of woo and her complete lack of evidence that following her inane suggestion will do anything positive to ward off cancer. Nothing at all to do with the discussion at hand. And science-based medicine does not exclude positive thinking from its repertoire, it is just v careful to identify and apply said aspect.

    Move the goal posts around some more, Hermano, and throw some more nail-resistant Jello at us, Anti-Vax, we always can use practice in exposing fallacies and nailing Jello to the wall.

  53. Hermano says:

    Wow, Michelle,
    You out-bested Fifi’s best

  54. Hermano says:

    What fair is fair,
    I’ll keep throwing Jello to you, and you keep throwing silicone bags to me.
    I’m running low on nails, will you throw me some Botox needles too, as long as they are FDA approved?
    I imagine you have couple hundred millions to spare.

  55. Hermano says:

    Here is more insanely funny stuff, courtesy Barbara Joseph, M.D.
    and her delightfully misogynistic and militaristic tractate ‘My Healing From Breast Cancer’.
    Google Books publishes several pages full of wooggets
    from this scam artist, such as
    “Suppressed emotions are toxic, love heals.” (p.177)
    http://books.google.com/books?id=mjfXx_SfSzYC&pg=PP5&lpg=PP5&dq=barbara+joseph,+m.d.&source
    She even mentions supplements.
    Bon Appétit!

  56. vinny says:

    The CAM Zombie marches on, and his argument remains: similar nonsense was said by an M.D., therefore you cannot be critical of Ullman ND. Two wrongs don’t make it right, Tiger Lilly.

  57. Stu says:

    Please don’t feed the troll, guys.

    Kimball: these are getting too silly to parody.

    “Be nice to your boobies, in a totally innocent, non-sexual way. If you don’t, you are evil and will get sick.”

  58. Hermano says:

    Vinny,
    You sound testy.
    Methinks your chi is out of whack: too much yang, not enough yin.
    Try acupuncture. It might help, might even change your life.
    I have a cousin on the East Coast , a trained MD, who now
    practices acupuncture exclusively.

  59. Fifi says:

    Hermano – We get it, you’re oblivious to sexism because you are yourself prone to sexism and feel that you are entitled to judge women for the choices they make about their own bodies and boobs (based purely on what you – Mr Hermano – want and think is right, of course). We get it that you hate “Western” culture which gives women the right to choose what they do with their bodies.

    We get it, you want to equate contemporary medicine with warfare and profit yet you won’t acknowledge that one of the most vociferous defenders of supplements and your fellow hater of EBM was part of the military and involved in developing torture techniques used at Abu Ghraib…for profit.

    Your “alternatives” sound like the bad old days that my mom and grandmother worked very hard to change so that women could choose for ourselves what we do with our bodies and our lives.

  60. Hermano says:

    Fifi,
    I am sorry if I came across as a sexist.
    I am sure I was being sarcastic and provocative at times, as I objected to Judyth R.-Ullman’s characterization as a misogynist.
    I do not know her personally, but I do know many naturopaths
    and I do not consider any of them misogynists.
    In fact, most of them are women.
    In Minnesota, over 90% of “educated” naturopaths are women,
    and majority of their patients are female as well.

  61. Fifi says:

    Hermano – Once again, you miss the point. I pointed out that the IDEA being promoted by Ullman is misogynist. It’s not about her as an individual but about a specific idea she’s promoting. As for your “coming across as a sexist”. You came across as a man who assumes he’s entitled to tell women how they should look and act and judge them by standards he creates. Why? Because that’s what you did. That’s being a misogynist. I’d be more impressed if you actually owned your misogyny so you could address it rather than saying a faux “sorry” ’cause you feel like you’ve tarnished your image or claiming you were just being “sarcastic and provocative” (disowning your own attitude and words and trying to pretend it was a “joke”).

    Since you obviously can’t see your own misogyny, let alone have the integrity to acknowledge it, it’s pretty obvious that you’re not capable of discerning misogynist ideas when presented by others. I have no idea whether other naturopaths promote the same misogynist ideas as Ullman does or if this is part of their “education”. It’s abundantly clear that naturopathy and the health supplement industry (as opposed to the sports supplement branch, which exploits males) targets women for exploitation for a number of reasons. The supplement industry was initially, and still often is, MLM and targets women looking for a second income, bored housewives who want to turn their years of working out into a “career” and get some wonky “education” from their local supplement pusher and so on. Just because naturopathy and supplement companies target and recruit women (and nurses specifically) doesn’t mean that they love, value or honor women (it’s actions not words that reveal true intent). It simply means they love women’s money!

  62. Hermano says:

    Fifi,
    You said “I pointed out that the IDEA being promoted by Ullman is misogynist. It’s not about her as an individual but about a specific idea she’s promoting.”
    This distinction, to quote a certain psychotherapist, well-enough regarded to appear on Oprah, is “bullshit”.

  63. Fifi says:

    Hermano – Just because you’re incapable of making a distinction between critiquing an idea and a person doesn’t mean that others aren’t capable of doing so. I can see how difficult being able to weigh ideas or treatments based on evidence would be for someone though who can’t distinguish between a concept and a person.

    Here is what I wrote…

    First comment – “What a misogynist belief to be promoting.”
    Then Hermano claims I’m calling Ullman a misogynist.
    I respond – “I am pointing out the ideas she promotes as misogynist.”
    And so on as you keep asserting that I’m calling Ullman a misogynist even though I have, from the start, been talking about one particular belief she holds. I find it doubly ironic that you’re attempting this kind of diversion when you’ve shown yourself to be actively misogynist (you don’t just hold beliefs but feel a personal sense of entitlement to judge women for the choices they make about their own bodies and lives). When called on your misogynist assumption and sense of entitlement, you tried to minimize it and pretend “it was just a joke”. Your inability to discern between critiquing an idea and a person does explain a lot though. People who can’t make this distinction are often so attached to the ideas they’ve taken on as their identity that any critique of an idea is taken as a personal attack and there’s an obvious inability to actually deal with ideas as ideas that stand and fall on their intrinsic worth (and evidence) rather than some neurotic extension of ego.

    I’d also add that Ullman misses the most empowering thing women can do in regards to getting to know their breasts and breast exams – regularly examine their own breasts so they know them well enough to know when something usual is going on.

  64. Hermano says:

    Fifi,
    MLM diet supplement industry actively fights against regulating naturopathic medicine.
    The Sunshine Health Freedom Foundation is a front for the
    Nature Sunshine Products, Inc, an MLM company which claims presence in over thirty countries and six hundred thousands distributors.
    Here, in part, are its:
    “PAST ACCOMPLISHMENTS
    COLORADO
    Naturopathic Physician Licensure Bills were defeated in 2007 and in 2008.
    IDAHO
    In 2008, a bill was introduced that threatened their Health Freedom law. Amendments were added to protect Health Freedom.
    IOWA
    A Health Freedom bill was introduced in Iowa in 2008; however it was not successful. They are hoping to try again next year.
    OHIO
    A Health Freedom bill was introduced that included Registration and was defeated. They are currently working on introducing a True Health Freedom Bill in the 2008 legislative session.
    VIRGINIA
    A Naturopathic Physician Licensure Bill was introduced that would have threatened Health Freedom in Virginia. This was defeated in the 2008 legislative session.”
    http://www.sunshinehealthfreedomfoundation.com/pastaccomplishments.html

    I have been visited by an Amway fairy in the past, a personal experience which created strong disgust with all things MLM.
    You may agree with the MLM industry’s objective to deny regulation for naturopathic doctors.
    I do hope you disagree with its method, which is to drum up fear and anger in uneducated people to create chaos and rouse a mob.

  65. Hermano says:

    Fifi,
    I follow about half of the things you say.
    I had a conversation with a published, Oprah appearing psychotherapist once.
    I was carefully drawing distinction between criticizing someone’s actions and criticizing that person.
    The noted psychotherapist said such distinction is “bullshit”, and it is much more honest to speak plainly.

  66. Fifi says:

    Hermano – Ahhhhh, I see how you roll. I make a critique of something and then you pretend that I support what I just critiqued (as being not worth supporting and fraudulent) and try to pretend that I’m saying something I’m not. Then you create a false this vs that to divert attention (misogynist and unsafe advice from a naturopath? bring up breast implants/call someone on their misogynist idea? make it about personality not ideas and laugh off misogyny as a “joke”/point out the connection between MLM, supplements and naturopaths? you make it about some faux naturopath vs supplement industry choice/faux dichotomy). Since naturopaths sell supplements as part of their business (even if in some places it’s recommended they don’t try to get their “patients” to also become distributors, for some rather obvious business reasons!) there’s a very clear connection between supplement manufacturers and naturopaths. It’s not like, despite your laughable claim, the supplement industry is “trying to deny” naturopaths regulation (how funny that you’re trying to propose that naturopaths are being “denied” by the very companies they support and that form the basis of much of their practice and income!). The supplement industry is trying to avoid having to base their claims, products and practices on evidence – clearly something naturopaths are also interested in achieving. It seems like a win win for both parties really – particularly for those who like to position themselves as eternal victims (while in reality they are the one’s abusing and exploiting).

  67. Fifi says:

    Hermano – Since you’re not even bothering to read what’s written there’s no point in bothering with you beyond this post. Though pretending you’re not paying attention could just be a another ploy that’s similar to your “I was just joking” claim in regards to your misogynist assumptions and sense of entitlement – another means to distance yourself from what you’ve expressed here because you’re lacking the integrity to own your words and the ideas you’ve expressed regarding women. Clearly you don’t understand the distinction between an idea/concept and an action, nor an idea/concept and a person. I’m not sure why you think I should be impressed by what a TV psychiatrist says (or are you just trying to impress imaginary female readers by snuggling up to Oprah?). Particularly one who promotes both flat out woo and medical woo even when he clearly personally doesn’t believe in the flat out woo he runs with for ratings. Now that’s bullshit and someone who’s clearly has moved beyond ethical bounds for a mental health professional! (Though having let his license lapse quite some time ago, from what I understand, he’s not bound to ethical standards.)

  68. Hermano says:

    Fifi,
    I re-read the entire thread to find what I said to deserve being called a misogynist.
    No idea, my lack of perspicacity likely the result of long-term exposure to testosterone, described as “brain poison” by a female friend.
    Michele,
    I re-read the entire post and really enjoyed finding your comment, which included a reference to pain de campagne.
    Two years ago I started baking crusty peasant style breads, large round “miche” style like you describe, and made over a thousand loaves. It is great stuff.
    I am now hoping to learn a way to make good rye bread.
    I have also been very interested in Eastern thought, which I think is something entirely different from New Age. Eastern philosophy provides a contrast to Western organized religions, but esoteric writings in Pali, Tibetan, or Japanese are a convenient way to get stymied or lost. Simplicity is really best.

  69. Fifi says:

    Hermano – Your friend apparently has some prejudices against testosterone, a natural hormone occurring in both men and women. If she associates testosterone with being solely male and being poisonous, she sounds like she holds some misandrist ideas. I don’t think your “perspicacity” is due to your maleness since many males don’t suffer from the same condition, it tends to not to be gender specific (as you illustrate via the example of your friend).

  70. AntiVax says:

    “German New Medicine is dangerous quackery based on no science. (Indeed, I’ve been meaning to do a post on it since SBM started, and you may have provided just the impetus for me to do so.) Worse, it’s a horrific “blame the patient” sort of philosophy where if a patient dies or doesn’t improve it’s because of an “unresolved conflict” that the patient is unable to resolve.”

    Quackery–Allopathic code word for the competition. Would blow away your medicine wouldn’t it. How your prognosises spread cancer. http://whale.to/cancer/last.html

    Whereas you KILL the patient with chemo or radiation.

    “In the end there is no proof that chemotherapy in the vast majority of cases actually extends life…”Two to 4% of cancers respond to chemotherapy….The bottom line is for a few kinds of cancer chemo is a life extending procedure.” http://whale.to/cancer/quotes1.html

    Not exactly a cure though. May ‘cure’ (5 year survival) 3% but given to 75%, do the maths.

    “Success of most chemotherapy is appalling…There is no scientific evidence for its ability to extend in any appreciable way the lives of patients suffering from the most common organic cancer…chemotherapy for malignancies too advanced for surgery which accounts for 80% of all cancers is a scientific wasteland.”—Dr Ulrich Abel. 1990 And not much has changed since then, except better poisons such as Taxol.

    I love the way you killed off most of the yew in the world rather than use the dozen or so herbs herbalists have been using for cancer, for millenia with some http://whale.to/w/orthodox_herbs.html

    and that is just the herbs.

  71. Mojo says:

    I call Scopie’s Law.

  72. weing says:

    Anitavx,
    And you believe that literature because…..?

  73. vinny says:

    antivax, I love the way you pull out meaningless numbers to support your argument. Thanks for the laugh.

  74. David Gorski says:

    I call Scopie’s Law.

    You do realize, don’t you, that AntiVax in a way is Scopie’s Law in the flesh because he’s John Scudamore himself, the man responsible for constructing and maintaining Whale.to.

    In any case, the way Mr. Scudamore relies on quotes instead of real data is characteristic of the mindset of many “alternative” medicine advocates. They accuse doctors of making arguments from authority; yet no one loves to cite supposed authorities more than they. The problem is, rarely are the “authorities” that they cite actual authorities. He also posts links to lots of claims (for example, his claims for the German New Medicine) but there’s no actual data there other than poorly documented anecdotes.

  75. DLC says:

    Wow. we went from Wampant Silliness about Weasely Words of Woo to Troll-fighting to Scopie’s law, all in one comment thread.

    My own attempt at translation follows:
    Every Boob is Sacred, Every Breast is Great, if a Tit goes unloved, God gets quite Irate. And then you get breast cancer.

  76. DLC says:

    Oh.. sorry for the repeat post but:
    And then you get breast cancer . . . Which everyone knows can’t be cured by your evil “allopathic” medicine you murdering swine!

    (insert Whale.to “proof” here.)

  77. Ranson says:

    B^5 translation.

    “Damn, I need to get laid. It’s been awhile. Those self-exams are sort of satisfying, though. Wait, what was I supposed to write about?”

  78. weing says:

    DLC,
    You could have made it rhyme.

  79. AntiVax says:

    LOL. Can’t take the quotes I see.

    Here are 1,200 citations showing Vitamin C is a cure for infections collated by dr Levy MD in his book http://whale.to/a/levy4.html

    And you don’t need to buy and read the book as I have put its conclusion into some nice quotes for anyone after the truth, not you obviously.

    “Many viral infectious diseases have been cured and can continue to be cured by the proper administration of Vitamin C. Yes, the vaccinations for these treatable infectious diseases are completely unnecessary when one has the access to proper treatment with vitamin C. And, yes, all the side effects of vaccinations…are also completely unnecessary since the vaccinations do not have to be given in the first place with the availability of properly dosed vitamin C.”—Dr Thomas Levy M.D., J.D. (Vitamin C, Infectious Diseases and Toxins p30)

    “Amazingly, vitamin C has actually already been documented in the medical literature to have readily and consistently cured both acute polio and acute hepatitis, two viral diseases still considered by modern medicine to be incurable.” – Thomas E. Levy, MD, JD

    cheers!

  80. AntiVax says:

    PS: ‘Scopies law’ will save you from that truth ;0)

  81. weing says:

    Anitavax,
    And this book by Levy is correct because…? You know it to be true because..? He wouldn’t lie to you because…? He wouldn’t sleep with your wife or girlfriend while you are away because…?

  82. David Gorski says:

    I wonder if Levy’s book cites any research more recent than 50 years ago.

    Looking at the Whale.to page, I rather doubt that it does.

  83. Harriet Hall says:

    Antivax,

    You are having trouble reading. I will try again in simpler words.

    You can find lots of studies saying vitamin C works. We can find lots of studies saying it doesn’t work.

    In the scientific method, we weigh those studies against each other and look at things like whether a study was well-designed, whether it involved large numbers of subjects, and many other measures of quality. There are reports that small series of polio patients recovered while taking vitamin C, but many polio patients also recover with no treatment. We have to do RCTs to control for the natural course of illness and other confounding factors. There isn’t a single credible placebo controlled double-blind study to support the claim that vitamin C “cures” polio. When examined IN TOTO the existing evidence does not support your claims for vitamin C.

    If NEW evidence surfaces, we are quite willing to change our minds. Meanwhile, scientific thinkers have ALREADY examined all the evidence you cite and have not been convinced. Until you have something new to show us, you are wasting your and our time.

    Statements like those of Dr. Levy are merely personal opinions. They are irrelevant because science doesn’t accept any individual as an authority. Anyone can cherry-pick the literature, find studies to support any opinion, and write a book. That’s not science. This is a science-based medicine website.

  84. Calli Arcale says:

    “Breasts are the most wonderful thing a woman can have, bountiful sources of love and creative energy, which means they are good. They are also storehouses for everything that has gone wrong in your life, which means they are bad. So obviously if you are happy and love your breasts, you will be less likely to get breast cancer.”

    Or, terser:

    “Don’t worry. Be happy about your breasts.”

  85. vinny says:

    Antivax,
    Don’t listen to them because they are merely agents of the Big Pharma. I have this totally natural and righteous cure for the common cold. It only costs 589 euros/week and is will work in 3 weeks or less. You can pay me by money transfer or send cash. I also have this absolutely natural homeopathic-bio-quantum-holistic prevention of death, but it is a bit more expensive. It does come with money back guarantee, and I will write you a check for the full amount if it doesn’t work.

  86. vinny says:

    BTW, can someone please explain what is allopathic medicine? I feel like I am being insulted by someone speaking a foreign language.

  87. weing says:

    vinny,
    I think that goes back to the 19th century and when medicine was divided between the homeopaths and the allopaths, the guys who used leeches, herbals, etc.

  88. Calli Arcale says:

    “Allopath” is a pejorative term invented by homeopaths to describe any medical practitioner who is not a homeopath. Today, it is used as a pejorative by alternative medical practitioners (including non-homeopaths) to describe mainstream medical practitioners, though some mainstream folks, unaware of its pejorative history, unwittingly use it to describe themselves.

    If you look at the etymology of it, though, it’s pretty weird. Strictly speaking, it’s the antonym of homeopath — “homeo” meaning same and “allo” meaning different. The idea is that homeopaths treat using the principle of “like cures like” and allopaths . . . well, don’t, I guess.

    I like to think of it a bit differently. “Alternative” therapies will often present themselves as a panacea. (To a chiropractor, every problem is generally a spinal subluxation.) So-called “allopaths”, however, are aware that there are no panaceas, and that there are many different pathologies requiring different therapies. “Allopathy” thus seems much more sensible to me than the homeopaths would want it to. ;-)

  89. overshoot says:

    Sorry for the thread drift, people (but not sorry enough that I won’t contribute!)

    John (“Antivax”) Scudamore:

    I’ll repeat a question I saw on MHA: “Is there any conceivable set of facts which would convince you that you have been wrong about cancer?” (Or vaccinations, for that matter.)

  90. AntiVax says:

    ” I have this totally natural and righteous cure for the common cold.”

    There never will be a cure, a cold is an elimination process with some emotional input. Never had one that I can recall, my brother in law used to love having one now and then and retire with some ‘Night Nurse’ liguid, must have had some narcotic in it. Being a heavy meat eater would explain that, plus heavy carbs input.

    “Allopath” is a pejorative term invented by homeopaths to describe any medical practitioner who is not a homeopath.”

    It is just the term used for medical doctors who use only pharma med. Allopaths like to make out it is used as a pejorative term as they don’t like the old homeopathic definition of someone just treating symptoms, and they don’t like being labelled as just another system of medicine, they like everyone to think they are the only one of any value. Plenty of MDs aren’t Allopaths, the ones who use nutrients for example.

    You have to have some term to describe that form of medicine and it fits the bill, see http://whale.to/a/allopathy_h.html

    Allopathy likes to make out it is the only medicine, based on science, and there is only one type of doctor of any use. Imagine if people knew they were seeing an Allopathic MD, as oppsed to a Nutritional MD, or Homeopathic MD, or Naturoapthic MD.

    Allopathy likes to use these names: Orthodox, Modern, Scientific, Contemporary, Traditional, Conventional or School medicine, instead of Allopathy. Go figure, I have.

    Allopathy is the expert at making words pejorative, eg anti-vaccine, altie, HIV denialist. http://www.whale.to/a/pejorative_h.html

    Alternative medicine is non-Allopathic medicine. Allopathy invented the term ‘complementary’ to get away from the word ‘alternative’, as they don’t want anyone thinkg there are alternetives, jsut things you do along side the chemo, like ginger to stop sickness, and you even get Professors of Com med, eg Ernst spending his life rubbishing homeopathy and the like. Says something about that term

    Language and definitions are very important, all part of mind control, as Orwell pointed out.

    I almost got barred from Wikipedia by calling an Allopath an Allopath and a vaccinator. Go figure.

    “The beginning of wisdom is to call things by the right names.” Chinese Proverb

    To see what is in front of one’s nose needs a constant struggle. –George Orwell

    There are some ideas so wrong that only a very intelligent person could believe in them. George Orwell

  91. AntiVax says:

    “I’ll repeat a question I saw on MHA: “Is there any conceivable set of facts which would convince you that you have been wrong about cancer?” (Or vaccinations, for that matter.)”

    For vaccination–Not unless you can prove all the government statistics for smallpox, for example, are incorrect. Or for measles deaths.
    http://whale.to/m/statistics.html

    Hardly likely is it, measles deaths declined by 99.4% before vaccination, kind of obvious really, and huge epidemics of smallpox followed compulsory vaccination and over 90% had been vaccinated. Leicester didn’t vaccinate for 30 years, and proved easily by stats the ineffectiveness and danger of vaccination, they lost 2,200 less children under 5 compared to their compulsory vaccination years.

    As for ‘Vaccine lymph’. Have you ever looked into that, I have http://whale.to/vaccines/lymph_h.html

    A finer example of “Who controls the past controls the future. Who controls the present controls the past.”–George Orwell (O’Brien in 1984) you would be hard pushed to find.

  92. weing says:

    Anitavx,
    That’s a crock. When I waz a yungun, the homeopaths treated you with powerful potions diluted to the max and the allopaths used leeches and herbs.

  93. Harriet Hall says:

    Antivax is repeating ancient misinformation that has been thoroughly refuted elsewhere. We need not waste time refuting it again. He has demonstrated that he is outside the science-based medicine paradigm.

    I really had to laugh at “Plenty of MDs aren’t Allopaths, the ones who use nutrients for example.”

    We all use nutrients, so I guess no one is an allopath! :-)

  94. overshoot says:

    Thank you, John — I’ll take that as a “no.”

  95. David Gorski says:

    You would be correct to so so. No amount of evidence will ever change Mr. Scudamore’s mind.

  96. overshoot says:

    You would be correct to so so. No amount of evidence will ever change Mr. Scudamore’s mind.

    I figured that out long ago on MHA, but it’s nice to have confirmation from the source.

    (Hey, you’re not the only one who uses both his given name and a handle!)

  97. vinny says:

    This is why it felt awkward to be referred to as an allopath. Well antvax I have some choice words for you as well, but I will take the high road and use a civil tone.

  98. Stu says:

    a cold is an elimination process with some emotional input.

    That is so absolutely blitheringly god-damned stupid, nothing more needs to be said.

  99. Stu says:

    Back on topic: would a song submission count? I submit Rusty Warren’s “Bounce Your Boobies” (as played by Randi Rhodes many, many times).

  100. vinny says:

    Some of the comments here could be accurately described as an elimination process, with emotion.

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