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Dr. Gorski pontificates about the Gerson Therapy on Uprising Radio

Every so often I get requests to be interviewed on the radio about skeptical topics. Now, why anyone would ever want to interview me, who knows? But they do, and when I can manage to accommodate reporters or interviewers, I do. Last week, I was interviewed on Uprising Radio, in which I discussed alternative medicine (particularly the Gerson therapy for cancer). My segment is around 10 or 15 minutes, and I invite SBM readers to take a listen. I’m afraid I might have been a bit “strident” in my dismissal of various bits of quackery for some. Whether I was too “strident” or not, the interview request came about in response to another radio personality on the same radio station shilling for the Gerson therapy, which reminds me. Perhaps I should revisit Max Gerson; for some reason there appears to be a flurry of promotion of that hoary old quackery. Stay tuned on Monday to see if that’s what I decide to blog about. :-)

Posted in: Cancer, Nutrition

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20 thoughts on “Dr. Gorski pontificates about the Gerson Therapy on Uprising Radio

  1. lilady says:

    “Too strident” Dr. Gorski? Hardly.

    I listened to your radio interview and it was excellent. The part of the interview which was most enlightening was your ability to discuss testimonials…and the difference between bizarre treatments such as juicing and coffee enemas…and science-based cancer treatment protocols.

    I’ll be waiting for your next blog on the Gerson Therapy.

  2. pmoran says:

    I also thought Dr Gorski did well, handling some tricky questions beautifully.

    I had a lengthy communication with Howard Strauss of the Gerson clinic a few years back, after we clashed on the comments section the BMJ site. He is able to sustain belief in what he does through the usual illusions, sheer lack of medical knowledge, and the belief that whatever his results are, the results of conventional methods (which to CAM supporters reads as “chemotherapy”) are worse. (I can to some extent understand why that should be so, with so many cancer patients undergoing chemotherapy with possibly inflated expectations and still dying of their disease.)

    I challenged Strauss to produce any cases where his methods induced established, proven cancer to go away, and he was unable to do produce them. His flagship testimonial at that time was a woman who supposedly was cured of “Stage lV, spreading melanoma”. When I contacted the patient directly, I found she actually had had a “superficial spreading” level lV melanoma removed (a relatively good prognosis lesion). She at most had early locoregional spread in a gland that was also removed surgically, giving here a good possibility of cure.

    Gerson is a busy enough clinic to be able to produce moderately useful data concerning their true results (as Hildebrand once did), but instead they chose to devote their resources into producing atrociously deceptive promotional videos.

  3. DevoutCatalyst says:

    The world needs more David Gorski, thanks for posting this! (hey Crislip, your latest Puscast is not downloadable, will you fix this please?)

  4. David Gorski says:

    BTW, I’m working on a followup post about Gerson for sometime in the next couple of weeks. I keep seeing a claim that Gerson did a clinical trial for skin tuberculosis and cured 446 out of 450 patients. I can’t find the trial or a discussion of it that isn’t basically the same story told on pro-Gerson websites.

  5. DavidRLogan says:

    I love your point about how massive a therapy-suppressing conspiracy would have to be, operating on multiple levels between thousands or even millions of people.

  6. Haha, yeah! And the only people clever enough to uncover the “truth” are those that found Natur4lCanc3rTx101_-_’s YouTube page! :)

  7. lilady says:

    I’m having some fun by posting on the radio station blog where Dr. Gorski was interviewed.

    Yes, SkepticalHealth, I did view that 6 minute YouTube video…the sacrifices I make for SBM, *Big Pharma* and the *Cancer-Industrial Complex*.

  8. Narad says:

    Ah, Pacifica. KPFK’s pledge carts for both “Aware” and “Inner Vision” include Gerson items as subscriber gifts (the latter is a real grab-bag, including Martinez and Null). Still, they had Clare Spark back in the day, for whom I have a bit of a soft spot thanks to Utah Phillips.

  9. lilady says:

    @ Narad:

    Did you read the “expanded” San Francisco Chronicle Review of the film?

    http://www.sfgate.com/movies/article/Movie-review-Beautiful-Truth-about-cancer-3177472.php

    “…..The Beautiful Truth” has its faults, most notably in its omissions. While the film gives time to critics of Gerson therapy (including Bay Area doctor and radio host Dean Edell), who say there’s no medical evidence of its success, “The Beautiful Truth” doesn’t adequately elucidate their opposition. For example, the Gerson Institute’s clinic is in Mexico because it uses drugs that the Food and Drug Administration bans for cancer treatment, but the documentary doesn’t stress that. Nor does it mention that a onetime supporter of Gerson therapy, an Oregon naturopathic physician named Steve Austin, tracked Gerson patients and found few cases of cancer recovery….”

    Oy, vey.

  10. pmoran says:

    “—an Oregon naturopathic physician named Steve Austin, tracked Gerson patients and found few cases of cancer recovery

    Here is that reference.

    Long Term Follow-up of cancer patients using Contreras, Hoxsey and Gerson therapies. Austin S et al. J. Naturopathic Med. 1994; 5(1):74-75

    Of 38 patients at the Gerson clinic 20 were lost to follow-up. 17 of the 18 remaining were known to have died and the sole known survivor still had active Non-Hodgkin’s Lymphoma.

  11. lilady says:

    @ P Moran: Thanks for that link. Why don’t you post it on the Uprising Radio website where Narad and I have been posting? :-)

    http://uprisingradio.org/home/2012/08/17/a-surgical-oncologist-speaks-out-on-the-perils-of-alternative-cancer-therapies/

  12. lilady says:

    Thanks Dr. Moran :-)

  13. Quill says:

    I enjoyed this interview, especially being reminded that surgery is the cure for so many cancers, with the adjuvant therapies being the “icing on the cake” as Dr. Gorski said. One of the marvels of life these days is surgery and it is so straightforward, too. Find the cancer then remove it. This seems a bit of ancient wisdom* and quite a “natural” thing to do yet apparently having coffee enemas, swallowing hundreds of manufactured pills and making various kinds of adjustments to one’s external environment are more “natural” than simply removing the problem.

    *Afterall, somewhere in the bible is the statement “The LORD will remove from you all sickness….” And it does say remove, not “The Lord will take the holy tea bush, brew twelve and five gallons, and shove it up your nether regions until the sickness is no more.” ;-)

  14. emerson24 says:

    Wow, if I was in the market for sheep, this would be the place to be.

    This guy is a quack. I find it interesting how a model of medicine which killed 1,000,000 people last year has any room to speak about what is safe, efficacious, and point fingers at other remedies as being ineffective.

    First, there is no remedy that works for everyone. And when they don’t, it doesn’t discredit them. I would guess that not one person in here has any medical knowledge, or first hand experience about medicine. Thus, they are easily led by someone who “sounds like an authrority.”

    I’ve been a PA for 13 years in the allopathic model of medicine. And I have went back to naturopathic medical school because I became tired of the severe incompetence of the allopathic model. I have seen first hand a hand surgeon perform unnecessary MRI’s on patient, take patients back to the operating room unnecessarily to remove pins which could have been easily removed in the office (common practice) so he could make more money, pad his H&P’s so he could bill more, and the list goes on. He wasn’t the only physician I seen do that. I have also see many mistakes made that were covered up.

    I would like to see any allopathic physician, who practices by the guidelines of allopathy, present their patients who they have cured. I would be waiting a long time. Absent the very few people who come off their lipitor because they actually took responsibility for their health, they would be very few and far between.

    But what I see in the naturopathic clinic is many patients coming in who have seen many allopathic providers and specialist who still aren’t healed. They are placed on medication after medication and get worse and worse. Each medication is toxic to the body, and after 7 you have a 100% chance of having interaction. The body’s immune systems job is to recognize self from non self. There is nothing about a big pharm drug that is natural to the body, or desired. I find it ironic how herbals don’t work, but yet Big Pharma is constantly ripping them apart to find the most active ingredient in it so they can patent it and make money. You can’t patent an herb, otherwise they would try.

    So what you have is quacks like this who practice in allopathic medicine who wind up adding to the demise of patients, giving them toxic drugs to “cure and treat” a symptom which is insanity, and then they bash other forms of medicine as not being “proven” scientifically. Well, if you want data, just look at how many people vioxx killed with heart attacks. Look at the caustic effects of Lipitor, and it’s still being prescribed! Now they are finding it is linked to auto immune problems, of which allopathy has no idea of what is. Furthermore, allopathy once said auto immune disease was quackery and didn’t exist! How’s that that for medical malpractice and gross negligence along with incompetence?! Heck, just look up Ignaz Semmelweis. This man was adamant that hand washing would decrease post-partum mortality in women. He was locked up in an insane asylum for this. And where are we at today? This is just a few situations in a sea of thousands where allopathy has done a disservice to mankind!

    You people need to stop listening to people like this who only have one agenda, and that is to steer you away from remedies that work. For example, the common cold alone rakes in 40 billion dollars a year in physician charges. Another 7 billion are spent on over the counter remedies, all of which don’t work. It’s a virus. Allopathy has nothing! However, herbs do work, and there are countless ones that do. One being Echinacea. But the studies that “they do” are done with a dose that is diluted 5X the amount that is efficacious. They also use parts of the plants that don’t contain the medicinal substance that works. There’s other ways in which they publish false information to steer the public in the wrong direction but I won’t go into it. And, it also needs to be taken within 24 hours or it won’t be effective.

    As for homeopathy, it works. I’ve seen it work. And people can argue placebo all they want, but when someone comes in with a stack of medical records from the failed allopathic treatments, and then after numerous weeks they leave cured, symptom free, and REMAIN symptom free, there is no placebo effect.

    You people should just google botanical medicine conference 2012 or whatever year it is, month it is, and put in a city near you. Do that for any conference for natural medicine. Trust me, it will be the best conference you attend and what you can do for you life. Get off the internet and stop trying to find out what is the truth. This joke would be eaten alive if he attended one of these conferences and opened his mouth my trying to peddle such non sense.

    I quite frankly don’t care what some person with zero medical experience has to say, or some fool who is on the pay roll of Big Pharma has to say. I have seen people cured with my own eyes. And remain so. You can tell me what study say what, I really don’t care because most “evidence based science” is funded by those with an agenda. If you don’t want to be believe me, then it’s going to be your health in their hands one day,, and I can bet my life that you will be failed, also. The great equalizer is this. The people who are too stupid to actually take the time out to go into public and find the truth rather than believe all this false propaganda on the internet and media will one day wind up heavily medicated by the same people who lied to them. Thus, their own purposeful ignorance will be their own downfall. You reap what you sew.

  15. Chris says:

    BINGO!

    Let’s see, I have copious use of “allopathy”, “the author is a quack” (because he does not like what was written), “toxic”, mentions of big bad pharma drugs like Lipitor/Vioxx, homeopathy, herbs, Ignaz Semmelweis, propaganda, “seen with my own eyes” (random anecdotes)…

    …and to top it off: exactly nothing at all to with with the actual article about a mainstream “allopathic” doctor (Gerson) who has decided extreme diets, hand fulss of supplements and coffee enemas cure coffee.

  16. Scott says:

    I find it interesting how a model of medicine which killed 1,000,000 people last year

    [citation needed] and even if true, doesn’t say anything about the actual risk/benefit without also quantifying the (much larger) benefits.

    has any room to speak about what is safe, efficacious, and point fingers at other remedies as being ineffective.

    Look up “tu quoque.”

    First, there is no remedy that works for everyone. And when they don’t, it doesn’t discredit them.

    When the remedy has never been shown to work for ANYONE, it does discredit them.

    I would guess that not one person in here has any medical knowledge, or first hand experience about medicine. Thus, they are easily led by someone who “sounds like an authrority.”

    The numerous medical professionals would beg to differ.

    I’ve been a PA for 13 years in the allopathic model of medicine.

    And apparently never managed to learn that “the allopathic model” does not exist except as a perjorative with no basis in reality.

    And I have went back to naturopathic medical school because I became tired of the severe incompetence of the allopathic model. I have seen first hand a hand surgeon perform unnecessary MRI’s on patient, take patients back to the operating room unnecessarily to remove pins which could have been easily removed in the office (common practice) so he could make more money, pad his H&P’s so he could bill more, and the list goes on. He wasn’t the only physician I seen do that. I have also see many mistakes made that were covered up.

    Did you report said surgeon’s insurance fraud? And how does that, in any way, indicate thatGerson therapy is effective?

    I would like to see any allopathic physician, who practices by the guidelines of allopathy, present their patients who they have cured. I would be waiting a long time.

    Since “the guidelines of allopathy” do not exist except as a delusion, you would indeed. Taking the statement as instead reading “science-based medicine,” the numerous people cured of cancer by surgery or chemotherapy, or who had their infections cured by antibiotics, etc. are quite easy to find. The even more numerous who are only alive because of vaccination are harder to identify.

    But what I see in the naturopathic clinic is many patients coming in who have seen many allopathic providers and specialist who still aren’t healed. They are placed on medication after medication and get worse and worse. Each medication is toxic to the body, and after 7 you have a 100% chance of having interaction. The body’s immune systems job is to recognize self from non self. There is nothing about a big pharm drug that is natural to the body, or desired.

    So because real medicine is not 100% effective and has risks, you’d rather just do nothing (i.e. naturopathy)?

    I find it ironic how herbals don’t work, but yet Big Pharma is constantly ripping them apart to find the most active ingredient in it so they can patent it and make money. You can’t patent an herb, otherwise they would try.

    Nobody claims herbs don’t work. We DO claim that it’s sheerest lunacy to take an herb when you could instead take a purified standardized extract of the active ingredient, and that many claimed herbal remedies have no evidence for their efficacy.

    Well, if you want data, just look at how many people vioxx killed with heart attacks. Look at the caustic effects of Lipitor, and it’s still being prescribed! Now they are finding it is linked to auto immune problems, of which allopathy has no idea of what is.

    They also provide actual benefits.

    Furthermore, allopathy once said auto immune disease was quackery and didn’t exist!

    Naturopathy hasn’t the faintest clue what the immune system even is – such knowledge stems from science. You also don’t serve your argument well at all by pointing out that real medicine follows the evidence and will change practice if the science says to.

    And where are we at today?

    Following his advice, due to science-based medicine.

    You people need to stop listening to people like this who only have one agenda, and that is to steer you away from remedies that work.

    Like you?

    Another 7 billion are spent on over the counter remedies, all of which don’t work.

    Then why do you sell them?

    However, herbs do work, and there are countless ones that do. One being Echinacea. But the studies that “they do” are done with a dose that is diluted 5X the amount that is efficacious. They also use parts of the plants that don’t contain the medicinal substance that works. There’s other ways in which they publish false information to steer the public in the wrong direction but I won’t go into it. And, it also needs to be taken within 24 hours or it won’t be effective.

    [citation needed]

    As for homeopathy, it works.

    [citation needed]

  17. WilliamLawrenceUtridge says:

    So because real medicine is not 100% effective and has risks, you’d rather just do nothing (i.e. naturopathy)?

    Naturopathy doesn’t do nothing. It’s excellent at separating middle-class healthy people from their money, and taking credit for mainstream scientific recommendations.

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